I voted for this, since I live in Washington.  There are strict parameters that must be followed.  I wanted it for myself, in case I was ever in the position to need it.  I do not want to be kept alive by artificial means and want to die with dignity. 

I read somwhere that in oregon, out of the thousands of prescriptions written for this purpose only about 30 were actually filled.

It made me think that maybe just knowing that they had the option should they choose to do so, it is there and makes those terminally ill feel like they have a little bit more control over the awful situation they are in.

I haven't had to walk down this path, by the Grace Of God, but my father did have hospice here at home while dieing. Not sure, but in a way that seems like assisted suicide since we administer Morphine which surpresses respirations. If nothing else it helps along the process. I know it is considered comfort measures, but for conversation sake, what do you all think?

I know this much and that is that I do not want a tube feeding just to stay alive, I am an organ donor and my family knows what my wishes are. To think that I would be given tubefeeding just to lie in a bed, really scares me. No way, no thanks.

But, back on track, as far as taking my own life, I really do not think that I would because it goes against my beliefs as well, but who knows what I may do if I was suffering.

I think it is easy to say you wouldn't do this or do that, but until you walk in someone else's shoe's do we REALLY know what we may or may not do. I can obvioulsy only speak for myself, but there are things in life that I have done, that I never thought I would, until I was faced with the same situation.

I personally just hope I am never faced with feeling so desperate that I would end my own life, and I know I couldn't take someone else's life, even if they asked me to. They would have to find someone else. I would administer pain medications etc... to keep them comfortable, but that is the extent of it.

I must say it went through my mind that I may have cause my dad to die sooner, by giving him Morphine, but I surely wasn't going to sit by while he moaned in pain. I am not sure if I am making any sense, so with that....

Dmazment

Can you explain the parameters for me, I have an idea but would like to know more. Thanks!

Angie

I agree with you, but some people do consider this a more acceptable form of Assited suicide. Not what I origianlly posted about but the subject did come up. I whole heartedly agree that pain meds should ALWAYS be given. It makes me so angry when people say that a pt is lying about how much pain they are in. Terminal or not. Maybe they are but pain is subjective! Pain is whatever the pt say it is right!

There is a Big difference between comfort measures and assisted suicide. The goal in giving narcotics to a terminal pt in pain, actively dying or not, is pain releif.There are of course side effects to  the meds, but the goal is comfort, not to "push them over the edge".I have no qualms about giving meds to a terminal pt that dying, because i know i am giving it for there comfort and diginity and they deserve all we can do for them in that regard.

I also have no problem giving pain meds, and or psyche meds. What nurses sometimes fail to remember is that after awhile of recieving pain meds, patients develope a tolerance to these meds and they do not work like they used to. I do not have any data, but personally I recently had an appendectomy and I felt like a drug seeker. The morphine just didn't work after awhile. I asked instead for 2 percocets and the pain went away.

With my dad, I was the one administering the Morphine and even though my brain new it was the right thing to do, my heart ached, and a small part of me thought, "maybe I gave him to much"., this I am sure is all part of the grieving process. Our minds will tell us all kinds of things during this time.I know this was ridiculous, but until you are the one giving your beloved father, mother, whom ever you really do not know how you will feel. I am sure it is the same for people who have to make any decisions for there loved one. Think about the poor parents who have to decide to withdraw life support on there children, or vs. versa.

Sorry back on subject, I really do not want to be a burden to anyone, but if two Dr's say I only have 6 months to live I think my family would be honored to take care of me, at least I hope so... LOL..I know I never felt like my dad was a burden...

This also goes against my faith. For me it is up to God when and how I go, and I wouldn't help with assisted suicide either.

I also feel that if someone wants to take their life they will do it, they will find a way. I do not think they need a law passing it to do it. I wonder how many people have done this that we will never know about, since they do not routinely do autopsy's on the elderly or terminal... just a thought.

dmazment says ...

I voted for this, since I live in Washington.  There are strict parameters that must be followed.  I wanted it for myself, in case I was ever in the position to need it.  I do not want to be kept alive by artificial means and want to die with dignity. 

Is this not what YOU would do????

I feel this is an individual's choice and we the people should not decide for others who what and how to live.  As long as this person is alert and oriented then hey who are we to decide? 

So I just had an awfull day. I got my first experience in being the one who gives the "last dose" Of SL ms and ativan. I was trying so hard not to cry as I was giving it because I knew darn good and well what this was going to do to him. He died about 15 min. later. I am devastated. I feel like I did this to him and that God is going to strike me down at any moment. Help!

Nursejenny1310 says ...

So I just had an awfull day. I got my first experience in being the one who gives the "last dose" Of SL ms and ativan. I was trying so hard not to cry as I was giving it because I knew darn good and well what this was going to do to him. He died about 15 min. later. I am devastated. I feel like I did this to him and that God is going to strike me down at any moment. Help!

Jenny, you gave someone in pain, the prescribed dosage as you were supposed to do.  You had a feeling it would happen and it did but this does not make you responsible for taking a life.  It was his time to go and he did, you had nothing to do with it.

dmazment says ...

Nursejenny1310 says ...

So I just had an awfull day. I got my first experience in being the one who gives the "last dose" Of SL ms and ativan. I was trying so hard not to cry as I was giving it because I knew darn good and well what this was going to do to him. He died about 15 min. later. I am devastated. I feel like I did this to him and that God is going to strike me down at any moment. Help!

Jenny, you gave someone in pain, the prescribed dosage as you were supposed to do.  You had a feeling it would happen and it did but this does not make you responsible for taking a life.  It was his time to go and he did, you had nothing to do with it.

Jenny, You did not do anything wrong... Period... Someone is always the last person to administer the meds, it just happened to be you this time. Are you a new (young nurse)? I have been a nurse for 20 years and believe me it never gets easy, but you do come to a place where you don't take it so hard. You did the humane thing to keep the patient comfortable. Continue to do just that, Keep your patient comfortable... Also know this, this happens all the time, just like this, it just so happened to be you this time.. God Bless You

This is exactly what I was talking about above, about giving my Dad his last dose of Morphine. I know in my heart that giving him the medication was exactly the right thing to do, but it did freak me out a little, and he did not die for hours after his last dose..

Hang in there, you will get through this and someday help a new nurse with the same concerns...

JUDLEERN says ...

dmazment says ...

This measure is not about what you would do but for the right to choose.  Would I honor someone's request if it was legal?  Yes I would.

 No, I would not... Now ditto to my above statement.. It is up to God to determine when it is time for us to go. That is my faith and that is how I feel about it.

Now if I am not mistaken you stated that YOU wanted this option for you, so I am free to post what I would do, and I did that above...

I believe the same as you, dmazment.  It is not just about the patient, and patients need to realize this if they are not the one pulling the plug, withdrawing treatment, or administering drugs.  My Christian beliefs would not allow me to do anything to assist someone in killing themselves, even if they were terminal.  We don't know how God may be working in their life or someone around them's life during the dying process, and we also know that miracles do happen.

There is a gray line (don't we always say this?), because when I worked on an Oncology unit years ago, we administered Nubain quite frequently to the patients, particularly the terminal ones.  We always had a staff/patient meeting, with doctor in attendance, to discuss the chances of the patient going into respiratory depression and dying.  The patient would sign a form that outlined these care decisions, along with the pros and cons.  Sometimes patients would rather suffer with the pain than be "out of it" and not know who was visiting or what was taking place around him.  For those who were ready to say goodbye and wanting adequate pain management, many times we allowed them to finish their wills, bequeathals, and saying goodbye to whomever they wanted, then we would begin the round-the-clock administration of the narcotic analgesic (lowest dose possible), knowing any moment could be his last.  These times were very hard on the nursing staff and we all gave each other emotional support.

Like dmazment, I would not presume to tell another doctor, nurse or therapist how to handle these ethical dilemmas, and sometimes the hospital ethicist or chaplain can help in the decision-making process, but the Bible does not condone suicide and I'd have to step aside and let someone else do what they feel is necessary under the constraints of the law.

Wow, what a topic!  I've also given Morphine many times to a person on Comfort Measures which would eventually slow the respirations until resp arrest and death.  It is very sad, but my patients were comfortable prior to there death and that was the most important thing to remember!  I am also a firm believer in giving pain meds to my patients.  I try to put myself in their place and I wouldn't want to suffer.  As far as assisting with their death by purposefully giving meds to 'kill' the patient --No, I can't do this!  It may be the patients choice to do this , but it's My Choice not to assist with this.  I believe that this would be up to God to take a patients life. So , in this topic I'd have to agree with JudleeRN. ,

I have only had to actually go against a hospice nurse once (not this particular one) and that as when she refused to let me give my pt a tylenol suppository for her temp of 103. She said it would put her in too much pain to to do it. Well I am sorry but a fever is VERY uncomfortable and I only had to roll her slightly just long enough to administer it. ( almost said something else right there lol) So I did it and told her if she had a problem with it to talk to my supervisor. Who I know already knew about the situation cause I told her and she agreed with me. I was right on that one. But the other one I am not so sure about.