I think everyone should be allowed to decide this for themselves. The parents can do the best they can to change their minds but in the end I think ultimately they would leave it up to the child. If however they are mentally uncapable to make the decision, d/t retardation or being a toddler etc. then they couldn't make an educated decision.

I wonder if maybe that 13  yr old girl probably suffered for a long time now and was ready, and if her parents agreed they must have known it too.

oh wow, I never cosidered that. That seems kind of heartless don't you think? I guess it would depend on the situation, the the ability of the parents etc. I never thought of the legal implications. Thanks for pointing that out.

It is sad that a  parent would have to deny their childs wish for fear of legal action though.

Wow GB, could you think of a more difficult question.  I'd like to say 18.  But I can't.  There are too many unknowns.  Religion is a major issue in these decisions, length of time spent suffering, etc.

I recently went through a difficult situation.  I called off a procedure that was recommended for my Mom.  I had agreed, then called it off.  Mom was dying anyway.  As her HCP I had to decide whether or not to take the chance of her dying in a cold IR dept. or staying asleep in the warm bed with me there next to her.  She died 17 hours later and the IVC filter wouldn't have really made a difference, but you are torn between maybes and shoulds and coulds and what ifs.  She may have died sooner, she may have lived an hour or two longer. Who can say?  I know she wouldn't have wanted to be alone

I share this because of the question of guardianship and HCPs.  It is sooo difficult to try to make that decision for someone who can't speak to you.  With a child, who can express themselves, you would have to hope that the parents or guardians and health pros, would have explained to the minutest detail the situation to the child and the parents would be able to know that their child has made a decision that was right for them.

There is really no answer that satisfies me.

How painful it must be to be the parent in that situation. I can't imagine ...

There have been similar cases, where children have refused chemo and/or radiation. Who is to say that a child is not emotionally mature enough to make the decision for themselves? I believe they are, and as a nurse I would always support a patient's decision. But as a parent your every instinct is to do anything and everything possible to protect your child. My heart goes out to those parents in these situations. For them, I would tell them that at some point there is no right or wrong decision. It just does not pan out to right vs. wrong, or best vs. worst. You can't win, no matter what choice you make. Disease process kills you, period. To say to a child, or anybody else, that IF you continue your treatment you could beat cancer is to put them in an unfair fight. If they had any choice, they would choose to not have cancer in the first place. Doctors and nurses do not want to fail, and we see death as failure. Maybe at a subconcious level, we don't feel so bad about it if the patient is the one who chooses to stop treatment. We're off the hook, so to speak. Again, it is not anybody's fault. It is disease process, and making a choice of how you want to fight it and for how long. No right or wrong answer.

How to spend the last moments? It isn't like the movies, as any nurse knows. I could never fault anybody for not spending their last moments at home. Some people don't have the coping ability to sit with someone they love while they die. It isn't a character flaw or a weakness, it is just the way we are made. I have been a hospice nurse, and was glad a few times that the patient died without anyone around. By the time family got there, we had cleaned up the patient and all the family saw was their loved one at rest and in peace. Some of the deaths that happened with family there were very peaceful. Some were not.

I hope the families of these 2 girls received support from their doctors and nurses. Too often, patients get the boot from their doctor if they don't agree 100% with treatment. Hopefully doctors will learn to present options to patients and families and be supportive no matter what choice they make.

OH God, that's horrible!!!!!       

A patient's life is in only one pair of hands...God's.  If a patient chooses to forgo treatment, that is his/her decision.  The parents should be there to support their child in whatever decision is made.  It is sad that kids should have to make such grown up decisions.  I think it is very sad.

I think it should be left up to the child to discuss with their parents. Then the parents should advocate for the child. Obviously, if this is a terminal case, or religious, then wow... what can I say. I just would not want the law to decide for US. However, like what was said above, you must take into account not just the child, but how educated are the parents etc...And do they understand all that needs to be known.

I can not image a family not discussing this over with each other and coming to terms and then letting the MD know their wishes. Again, this is hard, because their are ignorant people out there, so I think it depends on alot of circumstances...

I know it is hard to watch someone die, you can save with a blood transfusion, because I watched a 23 year old die this way who was Jehova Witness, and they are protected by law. It was really tough as a professional not to want to shake them, but we couldn't...

Hard question...

Yes Aggie, the case was from Texas. I heard about it from one of my aunts that live in NM. She knew someone related to the poor girl, from church I think. Wow, it's a small world! Isn't that a sad story?

it is a small world! but then again when you hear about something like this it just breaks your heart because you realize what these kids and their families have gone through when they get to the point of making a decision such as this

This is a very heavy question. My grandniece battled (ALL) Leukemia at the tender age of 20 months.  She thankfully survived but endured chemotherapy, intrathecal chemo, and multiple surgeries for about 4 years.  Her mother told me of the hours that they spent in the chemo ward with children that were much worse off than Megan.  She said that some of the kids had made peace with God, and were telling each other, you can have this toy, and my hairbrush when I go.  I think it depends on the maturity of the child, the severity and length of the illness as well as the parents input.  There are ten year olds  out there, that have more common sense and maturity than some 20 year olds.  This is definately not a one case one size fits all.

You guys have the dubious benefit of seeing this sort of thing regularly, I don't. It must be one of the most horrible things a parent has to do.

I also don't think a child under 18 has the right to die. If it is that bad, the child will have to rely on their parents to decide because there is just no way they have the perspective or maturity to make the choice. Heck most adults don't.

If they're going to die, die fighting, " do not go quiet..."

diane316 says ...

I think with the proper information given on the different options available, anyone under the age of 18 mentally mature enough, should be able to make their own decision, with guidance from doctors and their parents.

But whose to say which ones are mentally mature and which ones aren't? Thats a tough call in my book.

And in reply to thepainedone:........Of course it isn't fair for someone under the age of 18 to die, but what about the 25 year old mother(or father) of three, or the 30 year old mother of three. You can't really put an age cutoff here. And I do firmly believe that some children have the maturity to make this decision about their own lives and body. Especially when fighting life long battles with ilness. Some peoplejust don't want to put their family or themselves through fighting anymore.