RNprogressive says ...

If not a public system as an alternative to what we have now, then what?  I hear a lot of naysaying but no concreate ideas unless they are pre-packaged by the insurance for -profit companies.  Having been AD in the military and as a spouse we have universal health care and it works.  The government manages it and it works.  We do need wellness programs and if you weigh 300lbs you should have your lab work monitored and you should be enrolled in a program where you have to show up and get in better shape.  You don't get to feed your kids chicken nuggets and fries 5 days a week, our children deserve better.  One-third of kids in the US are obese.  Are you kidding me?  Are you all nurses?  Wake up! we have to get this country back on track and no Obama is not a fascist look up the definition.  Quit watching Faux and take a walk.  By the way P.J. Rouke is not a noted health care expert.

Getting this country "on track" does not mean more govt spending. And yes, we are all nurses. I will again reiterate that the only univerasl healthcare I've seen, is fellow nurses from countries who have this system, and worked with me in New Orleans. Their reasoning for being in New Orleans was the deplorable conditions back home in England, Australia, and Canada.

I also can recall detoxing pt's from Canada in New Orleans at midnight. When I asked why they were there, I was told that the hospitals in Canada were full, so yhey were sent to NO to detox off heroin.Another fine example of universal healthcare.

Conversely, how many Americans are migrating to Canada, UK, or Australia because of our 'deplorable healthcare'. 

Kittyrn says ...

Conversely, how many Americans are migrating to Canada, UK, or Australia because of our 'deplorable healthcare'. 

Thank-you Kittyrn. There have been stories. Last summer, there was a man from Canada with an aggresive brain tumor. He was told he had to wait 6 mos in Canada to have the surgery to remove it. problem was, he didn't have 6 months to wait. He instead had a charity funraiser and raised enough to come to the US in 2 mos. He had the lifesaving procedure. He has since spoken out about universal healthcare.

There are also women in England with breast cancer. There are drugs that can save their lives, but they are expensive. The govt said"too bad." Oh, that while their govt is scandulously spending money on moat maintainenece and maids!

RNprogressive says ...

If not a public system as an alternative to what we have now, then what?  I hear a lot of naysaying but no concreate ideas unless they are pre-packaged by the insurance for -profit companies.  Having been AD in the military and as a spouse we have universal health care and it works.  The government manages it and it works.  We do need wellness programs and if you weigh 300lbs you should have your lab work monitored and you should be enrolled in a program where you have to show up and get in better shape.  You don't get to feed your kids chicken nuggets and fries 5 days a week, our children deserve better.  One-third of kids in the US are obese.  Are you kidding me?  Are you all nurses?  Wake up! we have to get this country back on track and no Obama is not a fascist look up the definition.  Quit watching Faux and take a walk.  By the way P.J. Rouke is not a noted health care expert...

I agree on teaching our kids better eating habits and better ways to play.....................go out and run around, play ball, dont play video games unless its pouring buckets of rain.  However, I remember a topic you had on a different post fussing about obese nurses who smelt bad and wore dirty shoes.    Ok, that was harsh....................but we do need to present with a professional appearance.   Part of our job for our patients is teaching...........which would include diet, exercise and even hygene.   I have honestly told a dude he needed to take a shower with soap and use deodorant before he came to rehab the next day .............of course I took him aside and told him in private.   He was a 72 yr old farmer and was so embarrassed and he didnt realize he 'stunk'.   He then thanked me for telling him. I was afraid he was going on a shooting spree because nobody else ever told him that.   Our kids would be so much healthier and happy if they were active with physical exerting themselves............and they weill sleep better.   This could curtail bad habits that could protect them from diabetes and heart problems later in life.

I know people have hard times, been there and did it for many years............but in my book you can get a prescription you might need if you cut back on non necessary things in your budget.   My husband had some of our movie channels on cable turned off recently when gas prices started picking back up and we were running the airconditioner.   I was a little miffed; but I need to study anyhow.................and as long as I get Lifetime <love Lifetime on Weekends> im not gonna fuss too much, there are more important things to worry about. 

One thing that I do NOT support is if legislation tries to count health benefits from our companies as income............that would put my husband and I in another tax bracket.   Thats messed up.   What they are doing is punishing people who had goals, met goals by hard work and following the rules................then get slapped in the face and pay taxes on income we didnt get, but increased our taxes because WE have healthcare because we had career plans we worked hard on for decades and now we are going to pay for those who didnt.   Im not pointing fingers............but Im not gonna do it...............Like that guy on Glen Beck said "well they have cable in jail".    TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION.....................IM LOOKING FOR MY NEXT TEA PARTY FOR THE 4TH.        OK, CALL ME RN PROGRESSIVE JR BECAUSE I AM NOT PAYING FOR THE CHF FOR SLUGGING DOWN A 12 PACK OF COKE EVERY DAY AND SO MUCH SODIUM YOUD HAVE 4+ PITTING EDEMA FOR 40 YRS, OR DIABETES FOR DOUGHNUTS FOR 50 YRS AND NON COMPLIANCE WITH YOUR DIET AND A PROFESSIONAL COUCH POTATO EXCEPT NOT EMPLOYED BECAUSE YOU CANT TOLERATE EXERTION AT ALL;   AND NOPE.............COPD AND EMPHYSEMA FROM SMOKING FOR 40 + YRS..........IM NOT GONNA FUND THAT CRAP.   AND HOW THE HECK CAN YOU PAY FOR CIGS BUT CANT BUY ANY LASIX?  

Now I'll go and pray for hurting peoples feelings.

the gov paved the street outside my house yesterday.  it didn't need it but they did it anyways.  I venture to guess this is how the gov will manage healthcare...waste ...waste...inefficient.  however i cannot wait until that 300+ pound person pulls into their local drive thru and they tell him "sorry no food for you!"  this is how the gov will fund their "idea" If you think universal healthcare is going to be free you are wrong.  you will pay by losing your right to eat yourself up to morbid obesity.  the gov will simply tell these people sorry no coverage for you!! that goes for the smokers and the drinkers also..these high risk habits will be subject to scrutiny and subsequently your "universal healthcare"will be suspended. this is how they will manage costs and who or what they cover.  this is a free country but healthcare is not neither is freedom.  respect yourself if you can't afford healthcare but are paying for cell phones ,cable tv , fast food, smokes and speeding tickets maybe you need to look at your priorities.  I'm lucky i work for a hospital but i could have opted out of coverage if wanted to and many of my coworkers did.  its expensive and i never have needed it really but i keep paying the bill and im sure the premiums will go up again this year.  certainly there is a solution to this need for universal healthcare but the gov will surely not have it .  it needs to come from the private citizens and relying on the corrupt politicians who have the very best healthcare and retirement  packages is not the way to the solution.  it must come from us the hard working the selfless individuals who go to the job everyday .we have theanswers. thanks for listening and speak out  write to your local  politician.  give them an idea or two i'm sure they could use it!!!

I think there is a bigger problem with the American psyche, that we are all entitled.  Nobody wants to work and pay for anything (this isn't directed at any posts), just the people that I have come across in general.  Right now, the governement runs medicaid, medicare, chips, and military healthcare/VA.  The problem with medicare/medicaid.....is finding someone to accept it because the payments are often low.  The VA system works.   Why?  Ever try to sue a military doctor?  It is very near imposssible.  The military doctor has the freedom to make his decisions based on medical issues and not 'what if I get sued?'.  Also, everything is run like a pretty tight HMO, and the pharmacy has a very strict list of meds it uses, and if yours isn't on that list, than you pay big or switch to the formulary list.  

A few years back, I had the dream agency job.  Big drawback no health insurance.  My husband carried the health insurance.  One day he came home from work, and said that his employer could no longer pay the premiums and he would have to  pay them all $220/WEEK.   Obviously, couldn't afford that, so I took a job that I didn't really want so that my family could have health insurance.  It would be nice to live in a perfect world, but at some point we are adults and have to do the right thing by our kids/families/selves.  I don't think universal healthcare is the solution.  There are other areas that could be fixed IE cost of drugs, and lawsuits/litigations.   Both of these drive up the cost of healthcare for everyone.

I just graduated from nursing school in May and I had to pay for my health insurance. Since I was a student I could not afford the best insurance since I worked part time.  In March I was hospitalized and needed surgery after a miscarriage.  I now owe the hospital $ 6,000 worth of medicals bills and this is after my insurance paid for their share.  I don't necessarily want universal health care but affordable health insurance would be nice.  I think that if the government is involved with "reforming" healthcare it will mean more taxes and an increase in spending.  In Wisconsin they have developed a plan for universal coverage for the state called Healthy Wisconsin.  It is the same insurance that the state legislators get but they do not want to see this bill get passed through.  I had one legislator tell me that if this bill was passed that it would cause the spending to increase in Wisconsin. And that is something that the legislators do not want to happen.  I think it is sad that Americans can not find or be able to afford good health insurance.

Just heard from a close friend............her sister lives in England, is pregnant and they dont allow c-section's unless the mom is in distress or the baby is in distress.................there is no planning for c sections in England universal healthcare wont cover it unless there is imminent danger.  .    I was angry about the people here in America who might go through this.   Look, I had both my kids natural, hurt like a mo' fo'...........and the daughter was breech,  born feet first..........right foot first, then butt, then left foot.....like in a split.   Right shoulder was nearly broken.    You know when babies hold up both arms when they cry.........and go waaaaaaaaaaaa......eaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa............well, my aughter  only held up the left arm when she cried.   That doctor was an Air Force Lt Colonel... at .RAF Mildenhall.....that jerk told my husband to tell me to 'shut up'.    I wish I could remember the cuss words I called him.

True story:  A 24 yr old woman was denied her pap...........when she was 25 she had cervical cancer and was on a wait list for her meds.........this is universal health care in England.   Do we want this for our daughters?    I sure dont.   Yall know all the promises Obama made about no new taxes for anyone who makes under $250k?    Ok, we ALL know that was a big fat whopper of a lie. He is about to give us the biggest tax increase in history.   For those who dont realize it, those green laws will make our taxes increased so much and they dont even make it greener ............. for every 1% carbon dioxide we save, the carbon dioxide goes up 2% in China and India.................but we will be paying for that too.   Our oil production will probably shut down, those jobs will be lost.....at the refineries, they cant afford the fines because for this type of business they will have to burn coal.........and then we'll just import more oil from Obamas Daddy the King of Saudi Arabia.    He also said that regarding govt health care:  'DONT WORRY, IF YOU LIKE YOUR HEALTH CARE WITH YOUR EMPLOYER, YOU DONT HAVE TO CHANGE...........NOW HE IS CHANGING THAT TOO..............BIG WHOPPERS CALLED LIES ARE FREE FLOWING.    Dont forget with that brilliant program the ones of us who have decent health care insurance, we pay income tax on our benefits!   My husband and I said we'd suck it up and pay it......we wont let Obamaland reside in our home, we are going to stay free for as long as possible...........I guess we'll start hording gallons of water, canned food, toilet paper because then the USSA will be like Russia in the cold war.   I remember when the cold war was going on and on tv it showed the people of russia standing in line around the block waiting to buy meat, other food, and toilet paper was very popular in Russia during the cold war.  Look it up, Google it.............Im sure if you google Russia during the cold war you can see those lines and riots for necesities.  Ok, these next two lines are not for 2020, this crap will be going on within 5 yrs.   We will have our water rationed............our electricity will be rationed.............if you go over a certain kilowatts, they give you a fine............if you go up again, they double your fine.  They showed some Congressman on the news  who didnt read several pages of the potential law because he had over 30 pages missing out of his copy and signed it!     Those fines btw are going to be taxes.   Im wondering if any of those people who drive around with OBAMA bumper stickers feel just a teeny bit of worry?   Or are they indifferent and prefer not to bother with not agreeing  with somebody who might not be as popular or good looking.....reminds me of high school; they want to be in the cool crowd......Im glad im into plain  dudes and I have enough self confidence to have faith in my decisions.   My husband looks like the guy on Hitch  the cool dancer?   My husband looks like him but with a buzz cut  <retired Army Major............retired in '05 and kept the hairdo.   He's a doll!  He IS the cool guy now who is a very successful businessman.  did any of you ever see the geeky guys in high school who made good grades?   I bet those guys are the ones like the billionaires who are software engineers who are either married to a beautiful actress or unmarried and dates many models.   Those football players who were dumb as a bag of hammers and beat up the geek now are cashing their unemployment check and wanting an interview with my husband.  Im not stupid, neither is he..........there is only a matter of time when the company he works for will close down.  Im glad he had been preparing for the rainy day since clinton got elected.

As I always say................I dont care if im blasted.............and I bet the freedom of speech will be over on NL  because I spoke my mind.  Thing is I have not broken the terms of agreement.     Next thing you know they will kick me off this link like that did that chick who was asking for money send to her church in nigeria, yall remember that scam?   They kicked that chick off.............good riddance, she broke the terms of agreement.

I agree with Angie and Nurse John.  They are a form of tax.  The money has to come from somewhere.  If the government takes control of our healthcare, they will regulate what test can and cannot be done, what surgery is necessary, if we need a certain medication or not.  That is all great if you are healthy and have nothing wrong with you.  If you get sick, but aren't showing enough signs/symptoms, they may not do the testing that you need until it is too late.  All to save a buck.  I guess for the people that don't have any insurance, they would argue that it is better than nothing.  But seriously, is it really?  If you are older, and not as productive, will they get all the care that they get now?  Will doctors be allowed to test things that are necessary, or will they have to argue their case and maybe lose?  This list of questions goes on and on.   And again, where will the money come from?  Someone will be paying for it, I guarantee that.  I guess it will be new taxes on the people that are working.  It won't be free.  I think one of the first things we should do is get the lawsuits under control.  Why are trial lawyers making so much money on frivolous lawsuits?  We really can't afford more taxes.   

I am delighted about tis topic!  I knew once I began reading through the comments there would be pros and cons - I watched the "SICO" video in my Ethics class among other topics discussed and wondered when this would start buzzing again.  In any case this uject requires much research in order to argue or it or against it.  Personaly I am against it because of the regulations that would be implemented not only on the independent practices, but hospitals, clinics, etc.  While regulations are intended to protect citizens as well as practiioners - I fail to see that the reulations are working - Let's consider the FDA ? We are hering more nd more about drugs that are being removed from the shelves - FDA didn't do their job if that is happening - the drugs shouldn't have gotten to the shelves if this is the result.  The point is this, if something is broke you fix it, but everytime the goenment has fixed something they've ceated another monster and it gets worse.

Although reform is needed, unless the salivating people, who have been conditioned by what the government has tried to fix, are reconditioned so to speak - then we will continue down this path and it will escalate beyond recognition.  I will be entering the nursing field and it is a great concern to me that the govenrment would have the ability to regulae to whom and how much care I might provide this will be the issue if Health care is government.  I might also add, that I grew up as a military dependant and once again the government cut benefits for its military and their dependents - but change is coming right?  Has it taken the viet nam soldiers denieyed of their health related conditions - and what about the Gulf War guys in the early 90's - they too were denieyed their health conditions were a result of being n the gulf - It has gotten better I hear, but this is an issue that bears more research on the government regulating Hea;th care-

Government  is in place fo us the people not this reversed way People ruled by the government - These reform bills will promote a country regulated by its governement and this is what the salivating don't get - but why would they?!

Universal healthcare may sound good, but remember the government will be running it.

As a career government employee and attorney, it is my opinion that anything run by the government will become imcredibly difficult for the consumer to navigate, and eventually become totally screwed up and inefficient. The reasons are:

1. The government is overseen by politicians, who by definition have only one thing in mind: Getting votes for themselves and their parties, to whom they owe their jobs and souls. They will support anything that gets them votes, not what's actually beneficial to our country.

2. The government is an increasingly HUGE bureaucracy, which makes it increasingly inefficient.

Look at the Postal Service. It is slowly going out of business, because it is a quasi-governmental agency, while the private carrier services are far more efficient.

I wish the government would just stick to it's constitutional duties, and leave the rest to the people.

Many good point have been made throughout this thread.  I am completely for universal health care.  People have commented that individuals in England have been denied cancer meds, but every day here in the great US of A  our senior citizens are denied medications because they cannot afford them.  As far as advancements not being used, we are still one of the richest countries in the world, so we will always have people to pay the extra buck to have "better" care.  Doctors will still be able to make a good living, but everyone would be able to get the care they need.

Please read (between the lines,too)  this very telling current article on Healthcare Reform AND incidentally the AMA's

very interesting adament opposition to it.Incidentally,the AMA imo (and according to my Dr friends),isn't exactly progressive....

I did a study in my Master's program comparing healthcare in the United States, Canada, Germany, and Great Britain.  The purpose of the study was to try to determine what healthcare system was better and why.  In the U.S. we do have more innovative technology than in the other countries.  However, it does not reflect on the U.S. well with so many uninsured.  Yes, our healthcare system needs improvement and perhaps private insurance companies can work something out to find a solution, or they will end up losing to a government run healthcare system.  Furthermore,healthcare workers need to be weary about an Universal Healthcare System, because it will affect their finances significantly.  Healthcare workers will not make as much money as they are now.